Careful kids, the thought police are out in force today. Don’t say anything that might be deemed offensive by <some group I’m not part of> at some point in history!
I think it’s reasonable to ask why bottoming is presented as inherently degrading/submissive. (Same with giving oral - the insult “cocksucker.”) The vast majority of gay men I know are mostly verse anyway, the distinction of top and bottom to some extent seems like a carryover from heterosexual culture.
Like yes, it’s just a meme, but it’s revealing of larger problematic attitudes. I’ve made the same kinds of jokes too, but there would be nothing worse about Trump were he to receive anal sex from Musk (as unpleasant as that image is.)
Just a take look at history and how it all worked back in the Antiquity/Rome, which half the Internet likes to celebrate as gay friendly. It’s fairly ingrained in European culture/history.
The “Nazi femboy” phenomenon seems to harken back to that. Patriarchal structures aren’t undermined as long as the receptive partner is submissive/feminine.
I think it’s reasonable to ask why bottoming is presented as inherently degrading/submissive.
Yes, it is. But it’s up to the bottom to decide how they wish to be represented. Not for some self-appointed language police on the internet to decide for them. Among people I know there is a wide variety of attitudes about this but it’s absolutely universal that top/bottom/switch (or verse as you say) is indeed a power dynamic (that’s kinda the point for many) but only in that moment. It’s not a reflection of inferiority or weakness and it’s funny to me that people would think that. Makes me think they haven’t ever been involved in any type of BDSM activities.
Like yes, it’s just a meme, but it’s revealing of larger problematic attitudes.
Who gets to decide what attitudes are “problematic”?
I spent almost a decade of my life in TPE. Please do not lecture me about BDSM.
The acts themselves are not inherently submissive, and most kinksters I knew were uncomfortable with that suggestion.
I am deciding to express my discomfort with the terminology - that’s a decision I can make. I am a bottom, and submissive even! But I could also present the activity as dominant - in that I am lying back and expecting someone to provide me with pleasure. I have even “topped” individuals in a submissive way.
The meme is clearly presenting receptive anal sex as inherently degrading, which is a common narrative.
Don’t be sad. Think of it as a performance. We don’t get to clap at the end because in some communities that’s considered offensive, but I have heard there will be cake.
It’s not offensive to you, but it is offensive to others. This is a fact that, throughout this conversation, you have absolutely failed to see or accept. That’s all anyone here has wanted you to see.
I’m happy that you aren’t offended and you’re absolutely free to speak as you will. But your words have meaning that will differ from one person to another. That’s all.
It’s not offensive to you, but it is offensive to others.
I acknowledge that. I may not have spelled it out but I also didn’t say it wasn’t. You just assumed. You also assume that it’s offensive to some huge swath of people. How many? Who are they? Do you know them personally? Is there a percentage of the population at which we must stop saying certain things? Do people not members of the affected group get to decide this? I’ve literally encountered situations where people have told me not to use hand gestures common in my culture because it’s offensive somewhere to someone even though those people were not there and I was not likely EVER to encounter them in my entire life. I’ve had people make a huge fuss over correcting people who misgendered me even though I never fucking asked for it or wanted it.
That’s the extreme we are at now.
What this boils down to is people like yourself needing to control what other people are allowed to say and yes, even think. And I absolutely don’t mind putting effort in to respecting people’s wishes with regard to language when it’s asked for or it’s so obviously required. But that’s not the case here - the language police are always self-appointed. Look at this whole discussion. Did I miss all the gay men saying how offended they were by this meme? Did all my friends just lie to me when they’ve made jokes like this? Again, what percentage are we going by here?
You say oh I’m “absolutely free to speak” as I will but that’s not really what you mean. You mean to say “oh you are free to be an asshole by our sole definition and decree and never mind what you think”.
Careful kids, the thought police are out in force today. Don’t say anything that might be deemed offensive by <some group I’m not part of> at some point in history!
I think it’s reasonable to ask why bottoming is presented as inherently degrading/submissive. (Same with giving oral - the insult “cocksucker.”) The vast majority of gay men I know are mostly verse anyway, the distinction of top and bottom to some extent seems like a carryover from heterosexual culture.
Like yes, it’s just a meme, but it’s revealing of larger problematic attitudes. I’ve made the same kinds of jokes too, but there would be nothing worse about Trump were he to receive anal sex from Musk (as unpleasant as that image is.)
Just a take look at history and how it all worked back in the Antiquity/Rome, which half the Internet likes to celebrate as gay friendly. It’s fairly ingrained in European culture/history.
The “Nazi femboy” phenomenon seems to harken back to that. Patriarchal structures aren’t undermined as long as the receptive partner is submissive/feminine.
Yes, it is. But it’s up to the bottom to decide how they wish to be represented. Not for some self-appointed language police on the internet to decide for them. Among people I know there is a wide variety of attitudes about this but it’s absolutely universal that top/bottom/switch (or verse as you say) is indeed a power dynamic (that’s kinda the point for many) but only in that moment. It’s not a reflection of inferiority or weakness and it’s funny to me that people would think that. Makes me think they haven’t ever been involved in any type of BDSM activities.
Who gets to decide what attitudes are “problematic”?
I spent almost a decade of my life in TPE. Please do not lecture me about BDSM.
The acts themselves are not inherently submissive, and most kinksters I knew were uncomfortable with that suggestion.
I am deciding to express my discomfort with the terminology - that’s a decision I can make. I am a bottom, and submissive even! But I could also present the activity as dominant - in that I am lying back and expecting someone to provide me with pleasure. I have even “topped” individuals in a submissive way.
The meme is clearly presenting receptive anal sex as inherently degrading, which is a common narrative.
Who’s lecturing you? How are you being lectured?
At least we seem to agree. I’d have taken that as the opposite of a lecture. But hey, whatevs.
Damn. You’re annoying
Were you unaware of the “Block User” function?
Haha. Sex between men is a power dynamic. Teehee. Real intimacy is unattainable between male lovers. Giggle. Pleasure from anal sex is shameful.
Boo hoo.
Don’t be sad. Think of it as a performance. We don’t get to clap at the end because in some communities that’s considered offensive, but I have heard there will be cake.
Dude, people just pointed out that what was said could be offensive, and you went full snowflake. Chill out.
No. I went full “hey, here’s why I don’t think that’s offensive” and THEY went full snowflake.
It’s not offensive to you, but it is offensive to others. This is a fact that, throughout this conversation, you have absolutely failed to see or accept. That’s all anyone here has wanted you to see.
I’m happy that you aren’t offended and you’re absolutely free to speak as you will. But your words have meaning that will differ from one person to another. That’s all.
I acknowledge that. I may not have spelled it out but I also didn’t say it wasn’t. You just assumed. You also assume that it’s offensive to some huge swath of people. How many? Who are they? Do you know them personally? Is there a percentage of the population at which we must stop saying certain things? Do people not members of the affected group get to decide this? I’ve literally encountered situations where people have told me not to use hand gestures common in my culture because it’s offensive somewhere to someone even though those people were not there and I was not likely EVER to encounter them in my entire life. I’ve had people make a huge fuss over correcting people who misgendered me even though I never fucking asked for it or wanted it.
That’s the extreme we are at now.
What this boils down to is people like yourself needing to control what other people are allowed to say and yes, even think. And I absolutely don’t mind putting effort in to respecting people’s wishes with regard to language when it’s asked for or it’s so obviously required. But that’s not the case here - the language police are always self-appointed. Look at this whole discussion. Did I miss all the gay men saying how offended they were by this meme? Did all my friends just lie to me when they’ve made jokes like this? Again, what percentage are we going by here?
You say oh I’m “absolutely free to speak” as I will but that’s not really what you mean. You mean to say “oh you are free to be an asshole by our sole definition and decree and never mind what you think”.
What gives you that power?
tl;dr
Go yell at another cloud, angry old man (or woman, idc)
I’m over you.
Ah, you ARE afraid.
Good luck.